May 17, 2023

How to Best Use Podcast Interviews to Boost Your Book Sales - BM370

How to Best Use Podcast Interviews to Boost Your Book Sales - BM370

Are you eager to use podcast interviews to boost your book sales?
Tune into this week's powerful interview with Jennifer Longmore, media personality, ten-time bestselling author, podcast host, and CEO of The Podcast Connector.

Jennifer spills the beans on how to confidently pitch yourself for podcast interviews and add real value to the podcast community as a successful guest.

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Are you eager to use podcast interviews to boost your book sales?
Tune into this week's powerful interview with Jennifer Longmore, media personality, ten-time bestselling author, podcast host, and CEO of The Podcast Connector.

Jennifer spills the beans on how to confidently pitch yourself for podcast interviews and add real value to the podcast community as a successful guest.
Plus, you'll discover how to find the perfect podcasts to pitch on LinkedIn and other free resources.

Not only that, but Jennifer also shows you how to sell your book in a way that's engaging instead of one-sided.
Plus, she gives you valuable tips on protecting your intellectual property and boosting your profile through podcasting.

If you're an aspiring author or thought leader, get ready to take your author game to the next level with Jennifer's pearls of wisdom.

Grab your free copy of The Ultimate Pitching Toolkit

Click here to schedule your 20-minute brainstorming session with Susan


Susan Friedmann                                                                           00:40

Welcome to book marketing mentors, the weekly podcast where you learn proven strategies, tools, ideas, and tips from the masters.

Every we can introduce you to a marketing master who will share their expertise to help you market and sell more books.

Today, my special guest is Jennifer Longmore.

Jennifer is CEO of the Podcast Connector, a thriving global agency focused on connecting visionaries and new thought leaders with aligned podcasts so that they can spread their impact-driven message to the right audience.

She's a 10-time bestselling author, media personality, and podcast host.

She's also an investor, Board adviser, and serial entrepreneur.

When she's not running her companies, she'll be hiking with her family tending to her hundred-plus indoor plant collection, or dancing.

So, Jennifer, it's a pleasure to welcome you to the show. Thank you for being this week's guest expert and mentor.


And where are you calling in from, Jennifer?

I forgot.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         01:08

I am just north of Toronto.

You'll hear my Canadian accent.

I will say that I'm an honorary American.

I have like I would say about 95 percent of our clients are American, not that we, of course, discriminate, we serve everyone, right?

And a lot of my colleagues are Americans, so I always been referred to as the honorary American.

It's not until my voice maybe gets tired or I'm talking really fast that people will be able to hear the Utna boot I

Susan Friedmann                                                                           01:58

love it.

Well, we've got the Canadian and the British and then the and it's all sort of mixed in together a nice hodgepodge.


So, Jennifer, you are an expert in helping people generate 6 to 7 figures from podcast guesting.

With their book.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           02:26

I think that's fascinating.

I love the idea of being able to generate income from podcast guesting.

Let's talk about that because I know that this is something that I talked to my authors about the idea of guessing, but you gotta do it right in order to get the results.

So let's turn to you and say, How do we do it right now?


Susan Friedmann                                                                           02:26


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         02:53

just to be clear, I don't teach people how to make 6 or 7 figures from book sales, that's a big feat.


That requires a big publishing house to help with that or a massive massive following, but I do help people generate 6 to 7 figures every year from they're selling, meaning whatever services and products that they're selling, and a book can be a really great calling card for that.


What I think many of us and I'm saying this by the way as someone that's just about to publish their eleventh bestseller, right, that's coming out.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         03:33

And so I have the side of what it's like to be an author and all the things that go into that, I have the side of what it means to be a host and what it's like to get good pitches and bad pitches and have authors on that know how to tell instead of going into story, get stories sell.

I know what it's like to try and pitch myself and that's actually why I bought the podcast connector.

Because for years, I had to learn how to pitch myself really well to broker spots on that stack then with online radio shows and TV and publications and so on and stages.

I love that I can give back now and give people the shortcuts, right, and teach people how to pitch themselves effectively.

So it's kind of a legacy based business at this point.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         04:02

But there's some things that people don't tell us.


When we go with a traditional publishing house, They might give you, let's say, a 60000 dollar advance for marketing and for PR, and most people will pour that into a PR company and I'm sure there are PR companies listening and so this isn't to knock it because PR companies are great.

And we do need PR, but A lot of times those dollars didn't go anywhere.

They might have gotten pitched once or twice and if they didn't get picked up, then that was it.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         04:42

And so as authors, we think, oh, well, when I'm hiring someone to pitch me that equals guaranteed bookings and it doesn't.

It just means that person is taking usually a lot of money to pitch you to maybe a few outlets, and maybe you might get a booking, maybe you won't.

And meanwhile, we're thinking, oh, I'm going to be on 10 different really important shows as an example, right?

With the podcast connector, you're paying literally a fraction of that to get guaranteed bookings on various shows, and I brought that in because I know what it's like to hire agencies and to think I'm getting guaranteed bookings, but I'm actually just getting pitches and they're very different.

So I wanted to bring that in as a stopgap to make it feel easier because there's so much energy that goes into writing a book.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         05:12

There's some expense that goes into writing a book, and we can maybe have a little bit of financial spending exhaustion.

By the time it comes to doing the PR.

We're also not told that a book essentially is a business, right?

It requires its own marketing plan, but we can't just assume that if we put a few posts on social media that 10000 copies are going to sell.

It might, if you have a million followers, right, that really pay attention to what you're doing, But if you're like most of us and you have a decent size following, then we need to look at other ways to be spreading our message.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         05:20

And so podcast casting can be really effective in doing that.

That's fabulous.


And I'm such a believer in that.

You're so right.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         05:21


Susan Friedmann                                                                           05:38

do we do it right as the question is like, okay.

First of all, obviously, getting on the right shows.


And then once we're on those shows how do we optimize that opportunity?

Where do we start with that?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         06:00

I love that you're asking us.

And just for everyone listening, we are gifting all of you and Susan's gonna tell you about it, our ultimate pitching kit that's free because we have a ton of templates from there and stuff, and I go into more detail in that freebie.

So in the spirit of time, the first thing is we do have to research, right?

And I know you probably have this happen, Susan.

I get this all the time where people will pitch me and I'm like, you didn't listen to my show.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         06:11

You didn't research me at all.

You don't know anything about me.

This is completely misaligned with a show like your message is lovely.

I'm sure, but this isn't in alignment with what we clearly focus on this podcast.


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         06:26

That's just an extra frustration for everyone, but particularly if we look at our time, right?

It's a very low dividend thing to be pitching ourselves.

We can do it.

That's our zone of competence.

But our zone of genius is either being an author or being a service provider or whatever it is that only we can do.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         06:54

Other people can book us, for example, right?

And other people can do research, but if we're gonna pitch ourselves, we do wanna make sure that we are seeing that person as a human.

We're not cutting at it from what can I get we're coming at it from a place of what can I contribute because people can feel that a mile away.

And when I get pitched and I can tell someone or I even get it from some I'm not gonna say what publishing houses, but some big publishing houses where they'll pitch me and they'll say, so and so has just released a book and they wanna come on and promote their book on your show.

That's an instant no for me.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         07:15

Because I spend time money and energy as to you, Susan, building your audience that you cherish, I wanna be bringing valuable content to my community.


And so when someone thinks that just telling me they published a book and that they're a big name, that that's gonna be compelling enough for me to have them on.

It's not.

Now I know I'm a bit of a wackadoo when it comes to that because other people might say, oh, this person's a big influencer.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         07:31

I'll have them on my show, but not for me.

I love my audience enough to know who I want to bring on and how I want them to be poured into.

If they were to come on my show and say, hey, I would love to come on and help your audience with these things.

Do you think that would be valuable to your audience?

And by the way, a book.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         08:05

Do you mind if I mention it on the show?

That's a very different conversation than someone leading with the book.

Because what'll happen is, and you get this, I know everyone listening gets this, right?

Like when we're talking, there's a vibe that we're creating where people side whether they know, like, and trust us, and that is what compels people to buy, particularly as it relates to books.

Once they hear some of our anecdotes, once they hear a little bit of high-level stuff that's in the book, then it's way more appealing for them to wanna not only to follow us on social media, potentially go and buy from us, but especially buy the book.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         08:35

And 1 of the tips I have for that by the way is if you can create a freebie that is a sample chapter or 2 that people can download for free so that they can feel into it.

At the very least, that's a lead-generation tool for you.

But obviously, if they're 1 or 2 chapters in, and they're interested, they have no choice but to buy the rest of the book because they need to finish the story, right?

Whatever the story is for them, the process, the story, the insight, whatever it is that we're getting to people.

So that is something that I find really helpful but it even starts with the pitch.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         09:09

Once you've done the research, does this person even have guests?

If you're not seeing a single guess on our show, they probably don't want guests and not all podcast hosts want them because they want it to be a funnel to their company.

But if they do have guests, take a look at who's been on, what kind of things were they talking about, and what are the gaps?

What is someone not spoken about yet on that show and how can you position your message in such a way that it's still relevant to your book and it's still relevant to your thought leadership, but it's gonna be something with a twist that actually like sparks that person's Spidey senses to say, oh, this is amazing.

I haven't done this before.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         09:11

This sounds really cool and they lean in.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           09:27

I love that.


I mean, this whole idea of pitching and I talk about it on several shows too that like you, I don't pitch books.

But if somebody's got a book, absolutely, that's fine.

I'll mention it, but that's not the purpose of the show.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           09:40

1 of the questions that I get a lot, Jennifer, is okay.


I want to be on the podcast, but how do I find the right podcast to be on?

Could you help us with that?


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         10:01

LinkedIn alone.

What I love about LinkedIn side note, I've heard LinkedIn described as the most boring party on the internet with the world's most interesting people.

And I do find that to be true.

It's such an interesting place over there.

And I meet so many amazing people, but the vibe of that platform is kind of can feel kind of stuffy or a little bit too buttoned up, I think sometimes, right?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         10:24

But what I do love about LinkedIn is you can go into the search bar and just type podcast hosts or type podcast hosts personal development or health and wellness, finance, or whatever your topic is.


LinkedIn does the work for you.

It brings you up as a podcast host.

You can spend 2 minutes per profile, just kind of reading through what they're up to, who they are as a person, and do a little bit more research maybe 5 minutes in total, right?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         10:50

It's not actually that long, but it is of course time intensive.


If you want to be on 10 podcasts, you're looking at a good hour of research and then crafting pitches for each 1, right, having a draft pitch, but then massaging up for each host.

But that can be a great way to curate it.

Another way is to subscribe to Harrow, which is a free website, help a reporter out, they're always looking for guests, and you can subscribe to different categories so that they are again, bringing it to your inbox.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         11:12

I'm all about the Internet doing the heavy lifting for me, by the way, wherever possible.

And then the other thing we can do is do when we type into Google and have Google send us everything to our inbox that day that's relevant to whatever it is we're looking for.

So for me, I have 1 that's just for calls for speakers right, for the stages I wanna get on and calls for podcast guests, things like that?


Susan Friedmann                                                                           11:14

Those are the Google alerts, so they're the Google alerts.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         11:15

Yes, Google alerts.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           11:22


So that's an interesting 1.

So -- Yeah.

-- you would type in people looking for podcast guests.


Susan Friedmann                                                                           11:23


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         11:36

put some keywords in there or the types of topics that you would focus on.


So for me, personal development is great, thought leadership is great, and authors, intuitive development.

I mean, there's all kinds of things I can put in there.

I save myself from doing research.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         11:56

I could spend hours on Google trying to find podcasts or I can have Google do the work for me.

Ultimately, the same will be true for going to some of these large Facebook groups that are relevant to your community.

For example, there's a group I'm giving her a shout-out.

I don't get anything for this by the way, but there's a really large group.

I think she's got about 600000 members.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         12:25

It's called women helping women entrepreneurs.

There's always people making posts in there about, hey, I'm looking for some more podcast guests on these topics.

Who do you recommend?

You can go in the search bar on these groups and type in authors, you can type in self-publishing, you can type in whatever words make sense, and it's going to curate the conversations that are already happening in that group for people that are already looking for you for you to then insert yourself gracefully, of course, into the conversations and contribute to the posts and see what comes of that.


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         12:37

And then there's even free Facebook groups and also on LinkedIn, they're free groups where people are brokering deals with each other, essentially.


And where you have an opportunity to pitch yourself again to people that are already looking for you.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           13:03


These are really different searches that I love with looking for new ideas.

You know, I know that 1 obviously can go into Google and do a search on all the top podcasts in this area.

You still got a lot of work because as you say, you've got to find out to do they have guests and or is it really the right audience for you?

So yes, I like that a lot.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           13:03


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         13:35

then the next, you know, just a little aside because I'm sure all of you listening happen on podcasts.

Maybe you're just getting your feet wet or maybe you've done a gazillion, but once you build a relationship with a host, you can say, hey, do you know anyone else you know, whose audience would benefit from my message today?

Do you know any other hosts that are looking for guests to contribute to these particular topics?

And usually, they do.

And then you're saving yourself even more time because you're getting a warm intro from someone that already has a relationship with the host that's looking for you that they didn't even know they were looking for you.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           13:48


And hey, just before you mentioned, oh, I've got somebody I'd like to introduce you because I think they'd be a make a good guess for you, which is -- Mhmm.

-- exactly, you know, yes.

We're looking for that as well.

So -- Mhmm.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           14:22

-- I love networking.

I love these ideas of things that we could be doing.

I think 1 of the most important things you mentioned earlier and that is to have a freebie, maybe a chapter in your book, or some kind of lead magnet.

But What else do you need to do on the podcast to optimize it so that someone says, hey.

I really need to connect with this person.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           14:24

I think he, she is

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         14:39

just the right person for me to connect with.

Great question.

I always like to ask the host what's something valuable I can talk about today.

Again, I am a host and I know you are as well.

And so I always operate from that lens.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         14:58

I have for the whole time I've been in the business of how can I add value to this person's community.

When I know what the audience is really gonna wanna hear about, I shouldn't be going on that show, by the way, unless I know what I'm talking about.

I'm a big fan of staying in my lane and only going on shows where I feel I have a certain degree of mastery over a topic.


I'm not interested in just spouting out knowledge.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         15:21

I wanna be giving people something valuable.

And so when I'm in that lens, then I'm likely gonna be able to craft stories of what makes sense for the audience.


Again, I'll share maybe some personal anecdotes or I might share some client wins without it sounding really pitchy and testimonials y, which isn't a word that I just made up.

And then I also we'll see this is true of our business offers.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         15:43

This is true of everything, right?

Where I might say, I love that you asked that question.

We actually go really deep into that in chapters such as in my book.

But for right now, what I'll share is this.

And that way, I find very graceful ways to seed reasons why they should probably be getting the book because I really, and truly we only have so much time on the show, right?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         16:27

So the goal isn't to cover the whole book at all.

The goal is to pick maybe 3 to 5 really high-level talking points that you wanna go over to give people a general sense of the vibe of your book so that they want to do it.

And then when we're being authentic and we're being heartfelt and we're allowing it to be a conversation instead of a monologue and various things like that, that person, they won't be suffering from listener fatigue, right, which we all know what that is, and they're gonna stay with us through the whole show.

And even if they don't buy the book, they're still compelled by your story or they still really like you, and they wanna find a different way in.

At least you've planted some seeds and activated them in ways that they can carry on that conversation with you after the show, especially because these shows, our podcasts live on forever.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         16:50


That's the thing with PR.

It's not that PR isn't effective, it's that the news cycle is so rapid that your best-seller book gets lost and enfold, but on a podcast, that lives on forever, your freebie lives on forever, which is why it's always good side note to pick a freebie that you're married to.

Meaning that you think in 5 years' time you're still gonna be offering that freebie because you just never know when someone's gonna find

Susan Friedmann                                                                           17:31

the podcast and then find you.


That's so true because as I told you earlier, we've been going 7 years now with this podcast, and we're in the 360 plus episodes that we've done in the time, I know that there are people who go back and listen to something that I might have done 2 years ago.

With a guest because they've either looked up that guest or they looked up the topic area, and it came up on Google or even in my own category search, you know, they might find something, book marketing, author marketing, ebooks.

Now we've covered so many different topics.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           17:49

Over the years that someone might go back.

So, yes, having that history that's still alive that people can tap into You just never know where.

This somebody might say, oh, yeah.

When the student's ready, the teacher appears, don't they say that?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         18:14


I just discovered all kinds of reviews on 1 of my podcasts, but I didn't even know we're there because I'm a crazy person I'm just kidding, but I should know better right I said to my I want you pulling reviews all the time now because I wanted people to respond to people.

I thought this was happening with our production team.

And so I'm seeing reviews from like 2019 for this 1 show that I do.

And I had no idea these people were listening to me and I actually know them.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         18:29

And they didn't mention to me that they've been listening to the show, which they're not obligated to but I just find it fascinating.


So now I get to engage them differently and say, oh my goodness, I saw the review you left in 20 19.

I had no idea and it's a conversation starter.

I know something that

Susan Friedmann                                                                           19:04

you also like talking about is sort of the shift in book marketing and sort of what's working and what's changing in this world which there are books coming out galore over 3000000, I think, was the research.

And I've read recently that was printed last to publish last year.

So it's getting harder and harder to, you know, stand out from the crowd.

Talk to us more about, you know, what you see is working and what you see we can let go of.


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         19:17

glad you asked that.

So as I mentioned before, publishing houses give out advances.

They give it to you in piecemeal to allow you to do the marketing to help.

I mean, you're essentially helping them.

Get more publicity, right?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         19:44

Like yeah, you get to cook your name in with some big publishing house but the perks there are not there and most people are realizing now hey, wait a minute.

I want to own my IP.

I don't want to do this much work to make someone else wealthier off of my IP, and I think I'm going to control how this goes down.

And then on top of that, because the traditional publishing house industry is changing, which we all know, it's harder and harder to get those book deals.

The advances aren't the same as they used to be.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         20:11

Oftentimes once people go through that process, they get to the eleventh hour and it's contract signing time and then they find out that there's magically some new conditions that are placed in there that weren't part of the original agreement, right?

And all of that time money and energy being spent and tied up.

In a launch that, you know, you're probably looking at 18 months to 2 years before that book actually gets published from the time you sign the deal.

In solid publishing, we get to launch it as soon as the book's done, essentially.


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         20:38

And I always recommend finding someone to help with the best seller campaign you don't know how to do it yourself because why bother launching a book that nobody's really gonna know about?


We wanna be leveraging these search engine tools.

I mean, Amazon is probably 1 of the best search engine tools in the world, right, even though we think it's a storefront.

It actually is essentially a marketing tool, right, where we can put our audiobooks on there, we can put our published books on there, and so on, but we have to be more creative now about how we're selling books.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           20:38


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         21:10

if we think about it, podcast guesting as an example, and this is true of stages, like we're being positioned as an expert if we write a book.

Our brains can't help it.

If we see an author, we instantly assume they're an that's just how our brains work, what allows us to anchor our expertise even greater while going on platforms where we're positioned as an expert.

Right, even when you introduce me, you're introducing me as an expert in this topic, whether or not other people perceive it that way is up to them, right?

But here I am on a podcast and we know podcasts have experts on.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         21:57

So I'm already being positioned that way, then I'm borrowing your no like and trust that you have with your audience.

To be able to share my thought leadership on this topic as an example.

Then on top of that, people are deciding right now if they feel I'm at something valuable to their noodle, right, around what they want to consider for publishing and promoting their book and so on.

No leg and trust gets established very quickly when we position ourselves as an expert.

So whether it's podcast casting, whether it's being on stages, whether it's being a guest expert in someone's Facebook group that's got 10000 members or whatever the situation is, when we pair up the expert tools that we're using AKAA book with expert platforms and platforms that positions that has experts that shortens the curve even more.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         22:03

Because it seems aligned.



And even on top of that if we're a steward of our thought leadership,

Susan Friedmann                                                                           22:03


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         22:22

also wanna be mindful of what stages we are on.

To make sure that it's aligned with our brand that we are proud to share that podcast because that's what the host is gonna be asking us to do.

Because 1 of the things we forget about is that hosts spend time on e and energy producing the podcast.


I don't know if you're comfortable sharing with Susan.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         22:30

I don't wanna put you on the spot.

I can say for our podcasts, we probably spend 250 dollars per episode, right, to produce it.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           22:31


You have

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         22:41

all the time stuff in there and various things like that.


So some people will go on a podcast and think, oh, these people are lucky that I have another podcast.


Like, no, it's actually a joint venture, right?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         23:13

It really is a joint venture in that person has built a platform and is agreeing to extend their no like and trust to us.

And so how can we be respectful of that?

And how can we love up that host for helping us share with all leadership and the easiest way to do that, and really it's just kind of understood it's it's the unspoken handshake right when we're on a podcast that we share those episodes because we wanna be spreading that message anyways.

We want people to catch the fun things that saying on the show that maybe we haven't said before, but we also want to bring awareness to the host that was gracious enough to have a song in the first place.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           23:25


I love that.

It is a joint venture, and I've never looked at it quite that way.

You know, I was hope and pray that my guest will help publicize it.

But I can't enforce that.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           23:29


It's a sort of a respect thing that you would hope that they

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         23:30



Susan Friedmann                                                                           23:53

As you said, that they liked the podcast enough that they would want to share it with, you know, their fans and followers, which is obviously what I asked them to do.


So let us know how our audience can find out more about you.

Obviously, the podcast connector which is really a lot about what we've been talking about.


Susan Friedmann                                                                           23:58

How can they do that?

You can go to, as we mentioned, Susan has a gift that we've

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         24:30

offered as the ultimate pitching toolkit.

So if you want to just do it on your own, then you can download that for free and we've got all the pitch templates and a whole process in there of how to go about pitching yourself right from the research stage onward That's a great place to start.

The podcast connector spends a lot of time on LinkedIn and Instagram, so you're welcome to follow us there.

And then you can even just go to the podcast connector dot com there, you'll see an opportunity to apply to work with us as well.

We'd really like to partner with thought leaders that we feel proud to represent.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         25:04


It may sound weird.

I just know this from media, having done a lot of TV and so on, that my PR people, for example, build up a lot of relationship currency with different booking agents and different producers and so on, how it works and why it's so easy to guarantee is because we have relationships with these amazing hosts, right?

And so we have to be able to represent people that are really showing up as a leader, essentially right, that we're proud to represent that relate to us through the lens of we're partners instead of people that are admin assistants for them and nothing wrong with that happen if you get what I'm saying.


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         25:14

2 different types of leaders that will engage us, and we work with the ones that recognize that we're partnering and that we then invite them to be represented by us, essentially.


Susan Friedmann                                                                           25:42

We'll put all that in the show notes, the website, and then this very generous gift.

And by the way, listeners, I downloaded that gift beforehand, and it is priceless.

There are some templates in there that are extremely useful.

Pitch template and then the 1 sheet, which so often we all need to go on to other podcasts.

So that's lovely so, Jennifer, thank you for that.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           25:43

And if

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         25:44

you were to

Susan Friedmann                                                                           25:47

leave on listeners with a golden nugget, what would that be?

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         26:10

Oh my goodness, there's so many.

I did wanna say too, 1 of the things that have changed in the marketing lens and so maybe we'll end here is that There's a lot of really big podcasts out there that I didn't even know were charging to be on there.

Entreprene on fire by the way, which I can say because it's public.

Charges 10000 dollars per appearance, right?

So when we see people going on entrepreneur on fire, we think, oh, well, they're just such a big deal.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         26:49

They got on there because they're such a big deal.

No, they got on there because they paid 10000 dollars to be on there.

And there's not necessarily anything wrong with that.

Everyone gets to make their own business decisions about whether they pay to play, but what's happening is there's a massively increasing trend of people paying or charging money, I should say, to have you on their podcast.

So that's gonna be an additional piece that you wanna look for in your research because you're gonna end up engaging them, right, and maybe a significant amount of time and back and forth, email and so on to get you booked only to find out that at the eleventh hour, they'd magically oopsie doopsy forgot to mention that it's gonna be 500 dollars to appear, a thousand dollars to appear, that kind of thing.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         27:07

And that might be okay for you.

For me, I don't do that.


So That's not really something that I'm interested in, but I respect people's choice to do that, right?

But to my point before, because it is an expense to produce a podcast episode, I think people are just trying to offset their expenses.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         27:24

Sadly, they don't know how to pitch that and so they're not usually upfront about that.

Whereas, you know, with us, for example, we already know who's pay-to-play and we never ever pitch our clients to a pay-to-play engagement.

And on top of that, if we get blindsided, you're not even seeing that as our client because we're buffering you from all of that.

Kind of stuff.


Jennifer Longmore                                                                         27:44

So you can just get on with it.

But I will say, you know, there's never as Wayne Greski says, and I'm gonna say this because he's Canadian.

And I'm gonna give a shout-out to another Canadian.

You miss a hundred percent of the shots that you never take.

So just get started and when you start pitching, you'll get to see what's working, what people are responding to, what's landing with people.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         27:49

You just never know whose lives you're gonna change by getting out there with your message in your book.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           28:06

That's beautiful.

It really is.

It's so funny that you talk about "Entrepreneurs on Fire" because I remember when they started and I actually was a guest on their way back when they started out.

But now that they're charging 10000 dollars, whoa, I didn't even know that.

I think I'm missing out somewhere.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         28:26

I think so.

I think we need to create a course on, like I honestly get it.

I do get it because he must just get gazillion's like he probably is also losing money having to pay a team member that's solely dedicated to the volume of pitches that he gets.


Not unlike a high-ticket coaching container, not unlike all kinds of things.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         28:44

At some point, we do have to use pricing as a way to kind of separate out who's serious and who's Right?

And I'm not saying that I agree with that or not.

I can just see the logic of it for sure.

And I don't know if that's his logic, by the way, I don't know him personally, but I do know that I won't be paying 10 of dollars to go on that podcast.


Susan Friedmann                                                                           28:50

I'll go back into the archives and look for my episode.

It'll be even more valuable now.

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         28:51

Maybe Totally A little on

Susan Friedmann                                                                           28:53

eBay or something

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         28:57

for some ridiculous price.

It's like gold.

It's appreciated in value for you.

You're trying

Susan Friedmann                                                                           28:58

to do something, especially

Jennifer Longmore                                                                         29:02

with people knowing how much of a big deal it is.

Bring that episode back, that would be amazing.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           29:20

That's so funny.

There really is.

Thank you.

This has been quite a wake-up callers to this whole environment, so I really appreciate the gems that you've shared with us, Jennifer.

And thank you all so much for listening, and you know listeners.

Susan Friedmann                                                                           29:20

If your book isn't selling the way you want it or expected to, lets you and I jump on a quick call together to brainstorm ways, to ramp up those sales because you've invested a whole lot of time money, and energy and it's time you got the return you were hoping for.

Go to to schedule your free call.

But in the meantime, I hope that this powerful interview sparks some ideas you can use to sell more books until next week.

Here's wishing you much book and author marketing success.

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